Tulpa.info - tulpa-questions

I find it important to stay on task

Luminesce: So the switching hygiene I mentioned for example, is because drifting around with your identities blending willy-nilly is generally less satisfying and a lot more likely to lead to identity crises or dissociation (edited)

i mean i agree with the switching hygiene

You agree with one of the experience's guidelines I'm defining..

i agree with the idea

3:13 PM

so far i see a lot of people struggling to wrap their heads around what others defined when you talk about someone's experience and use their language to describe things, that's much more efficient

okay guys I'ma switch out cya later maybe

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3:13 PM

host need food

you talk proudly bout what community defined, but it makes people practice things for weeks or months or even years without results

KiTkAT( •̀ .̫ •́ )✧/jk

so far i see a lot of people struggling to wrap their heads around what others defined when you talk about someone's experience and use their language to describe things, that's much more efficient

I will agree with this--but it does make discussing things in a public forum a bit more difficult

Luminesce: I can't always vouch for random experiences people make up for themselves when they're not generally following community-established practices. (edited)

blanka

I will agree with this--but it does make discussing things in a public forum a bit more difficult

yeah which is why i do it privately with people

Luminesce: Some of them we happen to know are usually bad, but it's impossible to know all (edited)

KiTkAT( •̀ .̫ •́ )✧/jk

yeah which is why i do it privately with people

Indeed. And it's very helpful--but if we're discussing in a group with more than 2 people, it can be hard to discuss unless we get definitions down first

If you tell people to "just do whatever", you lose those points of reference for what's desirable or not

Basically, I agree with you, but this social context is different than 1-1

yeha i never told anyone to just do whatever (edited)

3:16 PM

what people need is a breakthrough experience, something they can relate to and build upon, which definitions etc don't help with

3:16 PM

definitions can come later, sure

3:17 PM

when you have something to put the label on

Luminesce: You better be somehow experienced with an endless array of experiences to be comfortable guiding people on whatever arbitrary things they decide, then. (edited)

3:17 PM

The strict(ish) definitions keep people in line having at least vaguely similar experiences, so others can still advise them

yeah, manufacture line

3:18 PM

make everything uniform

3:18 PM

as long as that makes you comfortable lumi

3:18 PM

anyway i'm off, i have a conference to attend

Luminesce: That's literally all tulpamancy is, long-time-community shaped guidelines for experiences we've discussed and hashed out in a lot of big discussion threads (and progress reports), putting some order to the arbitrary infinity of internal subjective experiences you could choose to have (edited)

but just a quick note, i don't think we disagree much, because my approach is also guiding someone into a specific experience

3:19 PM

but it's more of a conversation with the person, telling them how it feels, listening to how they describe what they are experiencing

3:19 PM

not putting abstract words in their mouths

3:20 PM

and if they describe something, i can say "hey, do you know that you can feel it this way?"

3:20 PM

not that "you should feel this way"

Luminesce: Sounds like trying to teach the meanings of words without teaching the words Easier but less useful for social/community contexts (edited)

definitions exist to facilitate communication, they can be whatever they need to be, it's the ideas behind them that matter teaching vocabularly doesn't teach tulpamancy. Adapting to how tulpamacers requesting assistance are describing their own experience is an essential part of practically assisting them. Teaching people about the generally agreed upon labels for certain experiences is NOT tulpamancy guidance, that's tulpamancy ARCHIVES and is a separate thing that people can learn to talk with whatever bit of the community they are interacting with

1

(otherwise you don't meet the community guidelines)

Reisen

Luminesce: Sounds like trying to teach the meanings of words without teaching the words Easier but less useful for social/community contexts (edited)

yeah, just talking about human experience

getting people to learn vocabulary and community archives distracts from them getting actual tulpamancy experience... tulpamancy is an internal practice that requires experience, and works for people even if they have never heard of tulpamancy before

it's interesting because i think more experienced people can have meaningful conversation using definitions (as long as they agree on definitions) because they talk about experiences whtn they use words. when you talk to a beginner, you talk about words, not experience

Ale𝕏andra 🍄🐈

definitions exist to facilitate communication, they can be whatever they need to be, it's the ideas behind them that matter teaching vocabularly doesn't teach tulpamancy. Adapting to how tulpamacers requesting assistance are describing their own experience is an essential part of practically assisting them. Teaching people about the generally agreed upon labels for certain experiences is NOT tulpamancy guidance, that's tulpamancy ARCHIVES and is a separate thing that people can learn to talk with whatever bit of the community they are interacting with

interesting way of putting it

3:23 PM

anyway i'm really off now! bye

KiTkAT( •̀ .̫ •́ )✧/jk

interesting way of putting it

ty I think it comes from me being more interested in deliberate plurality in general, rather than internet, originally-from-/x/-tulpamancy tradition specifically (final comment since this is questions channel)

Either way, very helpful to hear others describe blending

also i wanted to add that i agree lumi that reaffirmation is important but what happened here is: “no, you shouldn’t feel it that way, you should feel it the other way. you do it by reaffirming yourself. now reaffirm yourself!” when it could be different “oh interesting, it sounds like you had an experience! did you know that you can expand on it in this way?” the second option has reaffirmation from you, which can be very helpful for progress, especially for people that are having hard time reafirming themselves

update it was very hard for us to switch back and benn/wane stayed stuck until like now I think I'm back and if I'm not I'm probably going to be back then? But we used the switching hygiene when benn wanted to stay he was like I am benn I am benn, when I wanted to come back and started to feel myself more I did the same thing

wane ・💤🧠 ↩️

Reply to: host need food

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sorry i see that twisted what you said but i hope you can see what i mean

3:34 PM

i twisted*

Leiko

also i wanted to add that i agree lumi that reaffirmation is important but what happened here is: “no, you shouldn’t feel it that way, you should feel it the other way. you do it by reaffirming yourself. now reaffirm yourself!” when it could be different “oh interesting, it sounds like you had an experience! did you know that you can expand on it in this way?” the second option has reaffirmation from you, which can be very helpful for progress, especially for people that are having hard time reafirming themselves

Luminesce: If we don't guide people into having vaguely similar experiences, it'll end up a zoo where people like me will have no idea what to say when people ask questions about their one-in-a-billion experience (edited)

i don’t think that will ever happen

"If that's good that's good, keep it up, or if it's bad that's bad, maybe stop?"

3:35 PM

Awful advice

hm?

Luminesce: You could get that from a kid on the street, not a community dedicated to study of the stuff (edited)

"If that's good that's good, keep it up, or if it's bad that's bad, maybe stop?"

@Reisen - jump i’m sorry but i don’t understand what you mean by this

3:36 PM

i don’t think anyone said remotely anything like that

Luminesce: But that's what kind of advice you'd end up giving if you go completely freeform with people having whatever experiences arbitrarily come to mind (edited)

that’s not advice i give people…

3:37 PM

i talk to them and see where they are at

3:37 PM

i ask them how they experience things

We already see it constantly with "Guys I'm having [arbitrary and negative experience], what should I do?"

then i use their language to describe what an experience can feel like

3:37 PM

and i use their language to describe how it works

Luminesce: We guide them towards existing, similar, proven-positive/beneficial experiences in that case (edited)

3:37 PM

But if you refuse to do that, then all you can say is "Idk, stop? Or change it somehow?"

oh so you mean something different than this conversation

3:38 PM

i thought we were still talking about switching

Luminesce: I'm talking about leading people into existing (as in once arbitrary, but now practiced by many people, and defined) experiences (edited)

yes and my point is that you don’t need to introduce new words for people, you can talk about it using words they already know and can relate to

Well, you describe the experience and say "And that's called X"

i would rather help someone reach experience and say “that’s what’s called X”

Luminesce: Though you can't describe the entire experience every single time you refer to it everywhere constantly, that's ridiculous (edited)

3:41 PM

And not even how language learning works

no i’m not saying that

3:41 PM

i only talk about beginning

3:41 PM

later it’s fine to use labels to describe it

Luminesce: Hmm, it's hard to tell how "beginning" people are sometimes (edited)

that’s true

3:42 PM

but if someone is struggling, more definitions don’t help them from what i’ve seen

3:42 PM

and the method i described above does

Luminesce: I usually only say "We do imposition" when I think someone could reasonably know or look into what that is, otherwise I say "We do imposition, which is an advanced skill of learning to trick your senses into perceiving your tulpa in physical reality" (edited)

hello I am back

7:15 PM

currently the "host" is letting me switch whenever I wanna because he's always switched in

7:15 PM

I'm seeing that when I'm switched in he's just really inactive and just spectating

7:16 PM

this is normal right?

Yes.

Luminesce: A switched-out host could be as inactive, or as active, as a tulpa in their system normally could (edited)

i might as well be the host at this point

7:50 PM

he does consider me as the co host compared to any other tulpa

thats not abnormal

8:34 PM

I would say thats pretty typical and even healthy to have in the system

Do tulpas and hosts share an id but have separate egos and superegos, or am I thinking about tuplas wrong?

I don't know how up-to-date that model is. Pretty sure it's not very clinically relevant nowadays; but I think even if it is relevant, it's looking at tulpa from the wrong "dimension" so to speak

10:51 PM

(IMO, this is all personal experience)

I see

It's a manipulation of the identity function that your brain has. It's the part which builds "this is me" and "this is my friend Joe"

Mozzarella Supreme 🧀

Do tulpas and hosts share an id but have separate egos and superegos, or am I thinking about tuplas wrong?

I don't know anything about that model but for us, we share a brain but have different identities (including different hobbies, preferences, ways of speaking, etc)

You can build a new identity that has the same level of power/presence as the "me" function

10:52 PM

and that's what a tulpa is

10:53 PM

as far as what identity is? I think that's where you'd break out things like id, ego, superego--but I think other models may be more useful

I feel like what I'm trying to say is that I'm asking if tulpas and hosts share a subconscious, but have a different way of interpreting and mediating the needs of said subconscious that makes them ultimately a separate person and identity. (edited)

Maybe I'm just misinformed on id/ego/superego

it's been like, 8 years since I read anything about that